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I have omitted the last 3 arguments because they pertain to Christians. I wanted to present only the arguments that pertain to society as a whole.

Ten Arguments Against Same Sex Marriage
(This is a synopsis of the new book by Dr. James Dobson, Marriage Under Fire.)
Argument #1.
The implications for children in a world of decaying families are profound. A recent article in the Weekly Standard described how the advent of legally sanctioned gay unions in Scandinavian countries has already destroyed the institution of marriage, where half of today's children are born out of wedlock.

It is predicted now, based on demographic trends in this country, that more than half of the babies born in the 1990s will spend at least part of their childhood in single-parent homes.

Social scientists have been surprisingly consistent in warning against this fractured family. If it continues, almost every child will have several "moms" and "dads," perhaps six or eight "grandparents," and dozens of half-siblings. It will be a world where little boys and girls are shuffled from pillar to post in an ever-changing pattern of living arrangements-where huge numbers of them will be raised in foster-care homes or living on the street (as millions do in other countries all over the world today). Imagine an environment where nothing is stable and where people think primarily about themselves and their own self-preservation.
The apostle Paul described a similar society in Romans 1, which addressed the epidemic of homosexuality that was rampant in the ancient world and especially in Rome at that time. He wrote, "They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless" (v. 29-31, NIV).

It appears likely now that the demise of families will accelerate this type of decline dramatically, resulting in a chaotic culture that will be devastating to children.
Argument #2
The introduction of legalized gay marriages will lead inexorably to polygamy and other alternatives to one-man, one-woman unions.

In Utah, polygamist Tom Green, who claims five wives, is citing Lawrence v. Texas as the legal authority for his appeal. This past January, a Salt Lake City civil rights attorney filed a federal lawsuit on behalf of another couple wanting to engage in legal polygamy. Their justification? Lawrence v. Texas.

The ACLU of Utah has actually suggested that the state will "have to step up to prove that a polygamous relationship is detrimental to society"-as opposed to the polygamists having to prove that plural marriage is not harmful to the culture. Do you see how the game is played? Despite 5,000 years of history, the burden now rests on you and me to prove that polygamy is unhealthy. The ACLU went on to say that the nuclear family "may not be necessarily the best model." Indeed, Justice Antonin Scalia warned of this likelihood in his statement for the minority in the Lawrence case.10 It took less than six months for his prediction to become reality.
Why will gay marriage set the table for polygamy? Because there is no place to stop once that Rubicon has been crossed. Historically, the definition of marriage has rested on a bedrock of tradition, legal precedent, theology and the overwhelming support of the people.

After the introduction of marriage between homosexuals, however, it will be supported by nothing more substantial than the opinion of a single judge or by a black-robed panel of justices. After they have done their wretched work, the family will consist of little more than someone's interpretation of "rights."

Given that unstable legal climate, it is certain that some self-possessed judge, somewhere, will soon rule that three men and one woman can marry. Or five and two, or four and four. Who will be able to deny them that right? The guarantee is implied, we will be told, by the Constitution. Those who disagree will continue to be seen as hate-mongers and bigots. (Indeed, those charges are already being leveled against those of us who espouse biblical values!) How about group marriage, or marriage between relatives, or marriage between adults and children? How about marriage between a man and his donkey? Anything allegedly linked to "civil rights" will be doable. The legal underpinnings for marriage will have been destroyed.
Argument #3
An even greater objective of the homosexual movement is to end the state's compelling interest in marital relationships altogether. After marriages have been redefined, divorces will be obtained instantly, will not involve a court, and will take on the status of a driver's license or a hunting permit. With the family out of the way, all rights and privileges of marriage will accrue to gay and lesbian partners without the legal entanglements and commitments heretofore associated with it.
Argument #4
With the legalization of homosexual marriage, every public school in the nation will be required to teach that this perversion is the moral equivalent of traditional marriage between a man and a woman. Textbooks, even in conservative states, will have to depict man/man and woman/woman relationships, and stories written for children as young as elementary school, or even kindergarten, will have to give equal space to homosexuals.
Argument #5
From that point forward, courts will not be able to favor a traditional family involving one man and one woman over a homosexual couple in matters of adoption. Children will be placed in homes with parents representing only one sex on an equal basis with those having a mom and a dad. The prospect of fatherless and motherless children will not be considered in the evaluation of eligibility. It will be the law.
Argument #6
Foster-care parents will be required to undergo "sensitivity training" to rid themselves of bias in favor of traditional marriage, and will have to affirm homosexuality in children and teens.
Argument #7
How about the impact on Social Security if there are millions of new dependents that will be entitled to survivor benefits? It will amount to billions of dollars on an already overburdened system. And how about the cost to American businesses? Unproductive costs mean fewer jobs for those who need them. Are state and municipal governments to be required to raise taxes substantially to provide health insurance and other benefits to millions of new "spouses and other dependents"?
Argument #1:

The divorce rate in America for first marriage is 41%
The divorce rate in America for second marriage is 60%
The divorce rate in America for third marriage is 73%

So it seems that marriage as a whole, not just homosexual marriage is a somewhat failed proposition in this country. Also, if a homosexual marriage lasts, then the child gets to grow up with its parents, just like a heterosexual marriage. Homosexual marriages might be more likely to adopt, since natural conception isn't available (except through fertilization w/ lesbians), so that helps with orphaned children, or any child in need of adoption. Argument #1 is not an argument against gay marriage, it's an argument against marriage, so it's moot.

Argument #2:

This is a diversion from the topic at hand and is a slippery slope argument. We're talking about homosexual marriage and the laws associated with that. To assume that allowing homosexual marriage would lead to allowance of other non-conventional marriage arrangements is assertion without support. The issue at hand is homosexual marriages, not polygamy, or whatever you want to raise. When those issues becomes matters of law, then they will be handled. This is not an argument against homosexual marriage because it's reaching and asserting.

Argument #3:

Right now, the state's involvement with marriage is nothing more than authorizing a legal document. If you really think the state gives a hoot about marriage, you've got another thing coming. It's a product of the establishment to obtain fees for services rendered. Also, if people want to get divorced, that is their choice. It is not for Christianity to dictate the morality of the masses. This argument is based solely on religious morality, in hopes of enforcing it on the masses. This is not a valid argument against homosexual marriage.

Argument #4:

Last time I checked, they didn't teach what was morally accepted as marriage in school, and especially not elementary school. This is a fallacious argument, built on nothing more than hearsay and imaginary constructs of curriculum. They don't even teach what is defined as marriage in sex education classes. Marriage is not part of public school curriculum. This is not a valid argument against homosexual marriage because the basis is imaginary.

Argument #5:

The basis for this argument is that a mother/father combination creates a healthier environment for a child. There is no definitive, or even decent data to prove this point. This is an assertion, based on an argument from religious morality. Also, there are many heterosexual marriages that raise maladjusted children, so this is a moot point and not a valid argument against homosexual marriage.

Argument #6:

False premise. Affirming homosexual marriages is not affirming homosexuality in children and teens. We affirm the hell out of heterosexual marriages, but you still see people ending up homosexual. This is fallacious argument and not a valid argument against homosexual marriage.

Argument #7:

So just because something will create a fiscal burden means that we shouldn't allow rights to certain individuals? Really? Survivor benefits are minimal. I know. This is a horribly shallow argument against homosexual marriage. If you're going to make this argument, then you should go all the way and remove the state from authorizing heterosexual marriage. That will remove a huge fiscal burden in survivor benefits and maybe even free up a surplus in this country! COME ON!

"G"
Also, you had asked me in the other thread what other species exhibit homosexual activity. Here is a small list:

silver gulls (females): 10% homosexual 11% bisexual 79% heterosexual
black headed gulls (both sexes): 22% homo 15% bi 63% hetero
Japanese macaques (both sexes): 9% homo 56% bi 35% hetero
bonobo chimpanzees (both sexes): 0% homo 100% bi 0% hetero
galahs (both sexes): 44% homo 11% bi 44% hetero

There is plenty of information about this type of thing on the internet.

"G"
Geremy, I don't know what planet you live on. Here is just one example of what that book is talking about. And this is an old article. It's getting worse all the time.

Friday, April 28, 2006

Families File Federal Suit Over "Gay Textbooks"

On April 28th, WorldNetDaily reported that two Massachusetts families filed a federal lawsuit yesterday claiming their elementary school children were exposed in class to pro-gay indoctrination without parental knowledge or permission. Joseph and Robin Wirthlin and David and Tonia Parker argue in their lawsuit filed in U.S. District Court in Boston that district officials and staff at Estabrook Elementary School in Lexington violated state law and civil rights by indoctrinating their children about an immoral lifestyle, circumventing parental responsibilities. Article 8 Alliance, a grass-roots organization opposed to same-sex marriage, said the lawsuit is sparking national interest, with NBC's "Today" show and the MSNBC cable network expressing interest in coverage. Massachusetts Republican Governor Mitt Romney, who's also a Mormon, has publicly expressed his support for David Parker in the past.

Synopsis: The Wirthlins' involvement began March 24 when their second-grade son came home from school and repeated to his mother a story read to him earlier that day about men marrying each other. His teacher had read the book "King and King" to the class, in which a prince won't marry any princesses but instead falls in love with a princess' brother and marries him in a big palace wedding. The Wirthlins were further outraged when the teacher, Heather Kramer, argued that parents could not opt their children out of the reading because same-sex marriage is legal in the state. Kramer further explained that the theme of the day was "weddings" and that she wanted to present multiple examples of the subject. MassResistance, a part of Article 8 Alliance, claims that Kramer attended a presentation a year ago by the Gay, Lesbian, and Straight Education Network (GLSEN) on promoting homosexuality in the classroom.


The Parkers' involvement began one year ago when David Parker faced prosecution for trespassing and spent a night in jail after confronting school officials about homosexuality being discussed in his son's class. Their then 5-year old son brought home a book to be shared with his parents titled, "Who's in a Family?" The optional reading material, which came in a "Diversity Book Bag," depicted at least two households led by homosexual partners.
The illustrated book says, "A family can be made up in many different ways" and includes this text:

"Laura and Kyle live with their two moms, Joyce and Emily, and a poodle named
Daisy. It takes all four of them to give Daisy her bath."
Another illustrated page says:

"Robin's family is made up of her dad, Clifford, her dad's partner, Henry, and
Robin's cat, Sassy. Clifford and Henry take turns making dinner for their
family."
Parker complained to school officials, and at a scheduled meeting at school with the principal and the town's director of education, he was told an agreement could be reached. But after the superintendent intervened via telephone, Parker abruptly was told that unless he left the meeting he would be arrested. When Parker insisted upon a binding agreement before he left, school officials called police, who handcuffed him and brought him to jail, where he spent the night.

The lawsuit, filed against the principal, teacher, school committee, education director and health coordinator says, "The reason why the defendants will not inform the Wirthlins is that the defendants' specific intention is to coercively indoctrinate the children into moral belief systems that are markedly different from those of their parents." The school argues a state law permitting parents to opt their children out applies only to classes in which such sensitive topics are the main focus.

WorldNetDaily also reported two years ago of a North Carolina couple who also were outraged when "King and King" was read to their daughter's first-grade class.

Analysis: While elementary school students should have their questions about sensitive subjects like homosexuality answered, the answers should be simple, straightforward, and age-appropriate, promoting tolerance and understanding, not affirmation or celebration. Elementary school students should not be given textbooks actively promoting and protecting the homosexual lifestyle. The material in question clearly breaches that guideline. Also take note that the teacher used as her justification the state law allowing gay marriages. This is yet another reason to oppose gay marriages or publicly-subsidized marriage-related benefits for the domestic partners of gay employees - it serves as a Trojan horse for the gay-rights movement.

Locally, the Anchorage School District has an additional redress mechanism. Parents can appeal to the Controversial Issues Review Committee (CIRC), who will then evaluate questionable instructional materials, decide upon their disposition, and forward their findings to the Superintendent. Parents who disagree with the CIRC's findings can appeal to the Anchorage School Board and give testimony at their public meetings. The most recent example of this process took place on March 2005, when the Anchorage School Board, by a 6-1 vote, reaffirmed the use of the controversial textbook "House of the Spirits" in A.P. Literature. Click here for a more complete discussion of that issue.

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And as far as the polygamy and the rest in my last post, you don't seem to understand that these things set a precident. Polygamists are just waiting for this to be legal and then they can say "if it's okay for them, it's okay for us". Where does it stop? Open your eyes. There are some really perverted people out there and if the homosexuals get their way, then the polygamists get theirs, then the really sick perverts come out. Shall we make it legal for pedifiles to marry little children? And by the way, there are some men that want to make it legal to have sex with very young little boys. Shall we make that legal too? Morality cannot be relative to each person. We have to have some moral absolutes and we have to have some basis for them.
I live on this planet, where people who are just trying to be themselves are being oppressed by religious fanatics.

"G"
I'm not for them, but in the end it's not my business. Things sure got funky in the last 30-40 years........
And another thing Geremy. This is why faith must be an issue in politics. Because the politicians and judges are the ones allowing this to happen.
Geremy, I hit post too soon, and what you must have read was before I finished editing. Please read the remainder of post #3
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